Patrick Nolen of Sisters of the Road: “There was an article in the paper the other day and I’ve spoken to a couple of people about early enforcement, and in particular, PPI officers enforcing early.”
PREMATURE EVACUATION: Sit/Lie Comes Early for Rent-A-Cops…

Mike Kuykendall of the Portland Business Alliance: “Well, they’re not enforcing at all, so I can assure you we haven’t done that.”

Earth to Mike…This is Earth to the Portland Business Alliance….more after the jump.

Nolen: "The people I've spoken to say they were."

Kuykendall: "Well my understanding is that this group was here two hours before, and that when he came back two hours later, he asked them if they'd mind moving along for the benefit of Rite Aid. I can assure you that those officers have been trained, they haven't started talking about it yet. Are you aware that there's a new ordinance? Can I ask you why you're sitting here? Then the Clean & Safe Officers are calling the police bureau."

Nolen: "I obviously didn't speak to the officer, but I did speak to some of the people involved, and it definitely seemed like he was asking them to move along."

Kuykendall: "Well we have made it clear to the Clean & Safe officers that they are not to do that. Those complaints need to come to us. I can't investigate those things unless people let us know. I think there probably will be mistakes made, to be perfectly frank, but I'm hopeful. I need to hear things like that directly from the people and they will be investigated, and I'll take appropriate action if that happens."

Central Precinct Commander Mike Reese: "And I know John Hren [chief executive of PPI] immediately investigated once he saw the picture in the paper, I don't know that the PPI was talking about the ordinance as much as saying the business is continually calling, can you give them a break, here."

Genny Nelson of Sisters of the Road:"What are the two lines again, that the officers are allowed to use?"

Kuykendall: "'Are you aware there's a new ordinance that prohibits people in certain situations from sitting or lying on the sidewalk?', and 'Would you mind telling me why you are sitting here?'. They're not going be going beyond that in terms of anything. Then the security officer, if they feel it's appropriate, will contact PPB to follow up."

Monica Goracke of the Oregon Law Center: "I think it is really important for the police to follow up and do regular investigations, but I think it's also why we as an oversight committee exist. I know from my own experience it's hard to get people to give their follow-up information, but I guess I would just encourage all of us that if we do hear of problems, to get as much information as we can and bring it to this group as part of our regular oversight responsibilities. I think that's really important."

Kuykendall: "PPI started keeping track of all conversations where the ordinance is mentioned, starting yesterday. I also think it's important to look at the veracity of the accounts on one side or the other."

Nolen: "I think to imply that one side is any more likely to tell the truth about their experience of the ordinance may be a bit much."

Kuykendall: "That's true. Both sides could be doing it."

Nelson: "Given the nature of this whole issue, that's what's going to happen. People are going to have an experience and convey their truth about what happened. That's just a given, and I appreciate that you're honoring that both sides are capable of making mistakes and of not telling the truth. But in light of all that, what do we need?"

Reese: "I think, from an oversight perspective, you need facts. Time, date, officer involved, the location. And then if you start seeing patterns or that same name coming up, then certainly we will address and investigate every complaint, but if you start seeing patterns develop then we can start homing in on individuals and what may be some interaction problems. I think the situations need to be investigated by the police or PPI or PPS or whoever. But if we see patterns starting to develop then I would expect us to take a more systematic approach."

Kuykendall: "If they're not handing out their cards, I want to know about that."

Doreen Binder of TPI asked that PPI monitor its staff using grievance forms.

Nolen: "If somebody refuses to get up, is there a chance that that's going to be charged as disobeying a police officer?"

Reese: "It could, but I've asked officers to bring those issues back to this committee. And then we can give some guidance. But having said that, the officer's going to have to use some discretion, and they certainly could do that without calling me and checking first."

Deputy District Attorney Laurie Abraham: "Some people perceive what people say to them differently than how it was intended. People perceive that somebody is telling them to do that and it turns out, the person really wasn't intending their statement that way at all. You're not going to have a video tape."

We don't have video tapes, although the complaints about rent-a-cops are stacking up. But video tapes. Now, that's an idea...somebody also just mentioned "decoys." Any volunteers?