This Week in the Mercury
Wednesday, June 24, 2009
News / Politics Council Votes To Decouple Soccer & Baseball But $15million Hole Remains
Posted by Matt Davis on Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 12:24 PM
City council has voted this morning to de-couple the future of Major League Soccer and AAA baseball in Portland, but there's still a contentious $15million hole in the city's contribution to the project which threatens to scupper the deal altogether before the September 1 negotiating deadline.
"This has been the single most constructive instructive [updated Thursday, June 25, 11:49 am—"I said "instructive," not "constructive," says Leonard...your Mercury reporter apologizes for having misheard] set of processes I have ever been involved in," said City Commissioner Randy Leonard, introducing the resolution with characteristic optimism, given the history of the issue over recent weeks.
Multi-millionaire Timbers owner Merritt Paulson was nowhere to be seen at this morning's hearing, (update, 12:38: Paulson was in fact just seen going upstairs to the mayor's office, after the vote) preferring instead to be represented by former PDC boss Don Mazziotti, attorney Greg Peden, and his consultant, former mayor Vera Katz. Paulson and Leonard had a contretemps last week after Paulson's sudden withdrawal from Lents baseball.
"So many people have been arguing this issue from the point of view of dollars and cents, and I think that misses the point," said Leonard. "You can't argue public education, community colleges or universities from the point of view of dollars and cents. Just as with Major League Soccer, it's a quality of life issue."
"There are many Fortune 500 companies who want to know what facilities are available for their employees to recreate," Leonard continued, before Leonard and Adams thanked each other for their "creativity, passion and endurance" on this issue.
Peden showed them a video of soccer recorded from KGW channel 8, where a KGW sports reporter had been to watch the Seattle Sounders. "When do you start getting amped for the game?" asked a KGW reporter of a Seattle fan. "When I wake up," he said. Leonard laughed.
"We need to get this moving because quite frankly my job depends on it," said Mazziotti.
"To know that Don Mazziotti may lose his job is quite frankly weighing on me," said City Commissioner Nick Fish. "Don made a very generous bid at our children's auction and the prize was parking his kids with Commissioner Fish's office for the day."
After sliming Mazzioti, Fish then raised the question of co-location for baseball and soccer in the one stadium—at the Oakland stadium, Fish said, there's a dual use. "Is this a fundamental barrier?" he asked. Mazziotti reiterated that it was, because of the structure of PGE park.
"We're going to Timbers Army 2.0," said Timbers fan Jeremy Wright, who has commented here in support of the deal under the moniker "Finnegan" on numerous occasions. "I've had phone conversations with people from Newsweek, NBC news, all talking about Portland as a soccer city, and that would not have happened if you hadn't voted for Major League Soccer."
Then City Commissioner Amanda Fritz asked the big question: What's the status of the $15million in urban renewal money planned to fund the PGE park deal? And things started to get really interesting...
"No decisions have been made on whether or not to proceed with the creation of an urban renewal district," said Mayor Adams—visibly tense. "We're in the midst of evaluating that."
"There's no assumption of urban renewal, and we're looking at all other funding sources for our $15 million gap," Adams continued. "I think that it's everybody's goal to try to find another funding source than urban renewal, but urban renewal remains on the table as a last resort."
"By September 1, I don't believe we will have figured out how to fill that $15million hole but we will have made progress," said Adams.
"I've always believed that once the URA is formed this is a reasonable use of URA money," said Leonard. "But we haven't formed it yet, it would be inappropriate to commit the money. Nevertheless I want to be clear—and I've been back and reviewed the tapes—that Dan [Saltzman]'s objections were not to using urban renewal money itself." Leonard said Saltzman had allowed for urban renewal money to be used if the county and school district were at the table. Saltzman looked confused.
"I just want to be perfectly clear with the amendment that I offered back in March," said Commissioner Dan Saltzman—who voted back then not to use urban renewal money to support the deal. "The intent of my amendment was that if there's a $15million hole, I don't necessarily view that as our side of the ledger. If there is a process that leads to the creation of a new urban renewal area and this is going to come out of that, then that's going to have some time. And our attorneys have advised us that you can't borrow $15 million from an urban renewal area that is yet to be created."
"We may not all agree on that," said Leonard, referring specifically to 'whose side of the ledger' the $15million hole is on. "I think at some point there needs to be some integrity to our negotiations. We've made commitments on our contributions."
You could cut the air with a knife.
"The great thing about a democracy is that we can move forward with slightly different points of view on the detail," said Mayor Adams. "Today we're passing judgment on the resolution—we're not passing judgment on the mix of funding sources to fill that $15million gap."
We've been following the blah beginning of the urban renewal negotiations, but they are likely to get contentious in July as soon as the soccer issue kicks in.
"I want to state for the record that that gap was not on our side of the ledger," said Commissioner Fritz, voting. "I can't support any resolution that indicates that that financing is going to be funded with public money. I'm very disturbed that we are still spending so much time and effort on this issue."
Leonard sat next to her with a distinctly non-plussed expression on his face. The vote went 4-1.
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"We need to get this moving because quite frankly my job depends on it," said Mazziotti.
Are these people somehow physically unable to hear themselves speaking? That's the only way to explain either one of these statements.
"So many people have been arguing this issue from the point of view of dollars and cents, and I think that misses the point," said Leonard.
That's been painfully apparent, Randy. I would seriously vote to replace 60% of this council with chimps wearing suits.
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"You can't argue public education, community colleges or universities from the point of view of dollars and cents. Just as with Major League Soccer, it's a quality of life issue."
I laugh Mr. Leonard at your coupling of these "priorities"
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Hopefully I will be living far away from here when that happens within 5 years.
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And now Leonard wants to use what little resources our city has left for his pet project that is showing some serious hard evidence that it will never recoup the costs. You have to be kidding me. I'm fighting this one with everything I have.
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Sheesh.....
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"There are many Fortune 500 companies who want to know what facilities are available for their employees to recreate,"
Where might these fabled Fortune 500 companies be, Leonard? They're certainly not in Portland, nor will they be coming here anytime soon.
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throw flares on the PGE Park field?
i will be completely shocked when you type facts "portland lover"...
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Me bets your just an angry, petty little person with a personal vendetta.
Or just a piss-poor journalist.
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You clearly know very little about the Timbers Army. They have been associated with Habitat for Humanity for years. Why don't you go back to our board and troll some more. You'll find plenty of evidence of the TA's charitable efforts there.
Why don't you quit pretending you know anything...
Since I doubt you will bother here are some example's of the TAs charitable efforts in the past. I'm not documenting the thousands of dollars donated to Habitat for Humanity.
Outside In
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/…
Oregon Public Broadcasting
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/…
Habitat for Humanity 2007
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/…
Habitat 2006
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/…
Habitat 2005
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/…
You lost. We won. Quit pretending you know anything about the TA, me, Jeremy Wright, soccer, tax increment financing, Merritt Paulson, or anything relating to the city of Portland. You're a total fraud.
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Love you guys. Keep up the work.
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We need MLS, plain and simple.
MLS 2 PDX
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we don't NEED MLS. we need food, water and shelter. everything else is elective. i'm truly excited about the Timbers playing in the MLS, i think it'll be great for the city, but you need to get some fucking perspective, man.
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I think we all agree that everyone needs food and water.
There is always a different perspective though. Personally...pot holes and homelessness have been a problem since the dawn of time. We could invest billions on those problems and we won't solve them. I don't see anything wrong with investing a little money (literally its a drop in the bucket of the budget) in something a lot of residents in town are going to enjoy for a lot of years. Maybe that makes me a bad person...so be it if it does.
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and i'm not disagreeing with the notion of spending some money on this deal. maybe a little less than you think we should, but i'm not apposed to a little helping hand here and there to increase the City's presence. my point is, that you and your TA storm troopers would do well to turn down the rhetoric. you might find more people sympathetic to your cause if you do.
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Frankly, I'm starting to think that members of the TA need to get more hobbies.
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What about the MagicTheGathering Army or the Collective Order of Dungeon Masters United who would like public funding to bring BIG LEAGUE gaming to this fair city? Huh?
Or the Cat Fanciers Airforce who want to bring BIG LEAGUE excitement to our city by using public funds to build the Best of Show Stadium/Worlds Largest Hairball Museum right here ..in Portland Oregon.
Come on folks. City fuding versus pet projects??? Is it even a question.
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BTW - Spain 0-2 USA. truly fucking amazing performance today. we still need to fire Bradley, tho.
go USA.
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So, ""There are many Fortune 500 companies who want to know what facilities are available for their employees to recreate,"
And when Portland looks at how to better recruit more fortune 500 companies, these companies consistently say the same things over and over again: better schools, better and better funded schools of higher education and skilled MBA, engineering and science programs, better transportation infrastructure for the delivery of goods and services, better tax credits and other incentives like ones available in other cities and states, and better facilities and class A office and industrial areas. And more and better funded think tanks, research institutes and foundations, and better public-private partnerships geared towards tech and business clusters and incubators. Trust me, sports recreation is bottom tier on the list. Leonard is a fool, or a liar. Or both.
Timbers Army. Bah. What a bunch of whiners. Money talks and B.S. walks. I'm not holding my breath on the money part. The City is broke, has few other alternatives, and URA funding isn't going to happen anytime within the MLS time frame. Believe you me.
Nor should it. The City has more pressing problems. They need to be focusing on those.
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Schools = Quality of life for 500K people, TA = Quality of life for 200 lonely boys. THese boys can't even be more original than aping Britsh soccer fans.
"pot holes and homelessness have been a problem since the dawn of time."
Ya know what, so has cancer been a problem, but we don't find every little pet project ot spend money on before we spend it on cancer research. Does the TA realize there are other people besides the TA in this town?
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I can't think of a city in America filled with more skilled MBAs working as baristas as in Portland. I moved here 13 years ago and its been like that for at least 10 of them.
"Does the TA realize there are other people besides the TA in this town?"
Yep...we do. You see here is the problem. We like to fund art programs too. The city and state spends lots of money within the city on art programs throughout our city. I'm sure we could save $30-$40 million just by cutting the arts and music programs around town.
See there are lots of ways to fill potholes.
That's the hypocrisy in it all. You can't support one without supporting the other without sounding like a complete douchebag. Either you're a pretention asshole who thinks you're better than everyone else because you're more cultured or you're a drunk jock douchebag who grunts and chest bumps.
I like art. I support the funding of the arts. I also like sports and support the funding of them too. Lots of people around the city enjoy the arts and sports. Neither is better than the other.
So if you want to be fair you have to be supportive of cutting off all arts and music funding at this point as well as not funding the stadium because in all honesty...in this financial crisis we shouldn't be spending our money of frivilous things like the arts that only a small portion of the city enjoys.
See what I did there?
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City find funding for much needed pothole repairs? Since you seem adamant on saying there are lots of ways to fill them, please do tell. City of Portland could use that advice.
Also, do you have stats or a credible source on the number of MBA baristas in PDX? Cause otherwise, I'm led to believe you just making stuff up. Which is the polite way of saying you are pulling stuff out of your butt. Again.
"See What I Did There"
Yes, You used illogical reasoning and have a weak argument. Again.
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Outside In
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/
Oregon Public Broadcasting
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/
Habitat for Humanity 2007
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/
Habitat 2006
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/
Habitat 2005
http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/
Funding for MLS2PDX helps non-profits just as the arts programs do.
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It's not illogical reasoning. Take any story about a job in Portland. People with MBAs, MFAs, etc are competing for retail jobs right now. That's a terrible argument.
You argue that some arts are non-profits. Sure...some are. So...why are we funding them if they can't make enough to survive on their own? Your logic isn't translating. They aren't basic services yet we're still kicking them down money. Methinks if enough people gave a rip about ballet they wouldn't be begging for money...oh did I mention that plenty of the TA spent a night at the ballet to help raise money? Weird huh? Soccer fans watching ballet... Gosh how about those concerts up at Washington Park that the city is kicking money down to. We're in an economic crisis people. We shouldn't be wasting money on concerts in the park. OMG freak out! Wait...Memorial Coliseum is like...the premiere concert destination in Portland...it only loses money to the tune of half a million a year or so and needs $15-$60 million in renovations...god...we totally need a $30 million dollar city funded concert venue. That wonderful remodel of the armory for the theater...gosh how much did that cost? My god...the children could have used that money! What a total waste.
So just admit it...you don't like sports but you like the arts and fail to see the correlation.
Pothole funding. Home Depot sells asphalt for around $5.00 a bag. Do the city a service and fill the one in front of your house like I did...its not rocket science.
You're not going to win on that. Plenty of private arts institutions have been funded with public money. We could totally be spending that money on potholes.
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Also, I love sports. I used to be a season ticket holder for the Timbers (but have been utterly turned off by the whole enterprise since this MLS crap started), and went to a bunch of Blazers games this winter. And my brother played on the Cleveland Force in the 1980s where I went to just about every home game I could. I was on swim team and tennis team in high-school and was a competitive equestrian in high-school and college so don't for one fucking second assume you know anything about me troll man. I think I've been to one arts event in Portland in the past six months.
And I was against Armory funding.
Blackedout, you are a troll. And an ass. Done responding to you because seriously, you are probably the most idiotic pro-MLS person I've ever encountered.
But you know what's great about you? You actually are a detriment to anyone who supports MLS and the Timbers Army in particular, and that makes it so much easier for the rest of us.
It's really the people in power who matter, and the overall vocal court of public opinion made up of many people, not just one or two trolls. And those people who matter happen to be City Council, and other decision makers, active citizens and groups, including arts groups. Those are the ones that really matter. Not you.
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What hypocrisy? ALl the taxpayers ever wanted was basic services to be supported. That doesn't mean soccer stadiums for you, Armory Theaters for Sam/Vera's friends when they have a perfectly good theater already.
Where do we draw the line? To be consistent, when CoP can supply water without raising the price 18%, Randy/Dan can do their jobs without a 3% raise when there is 12% unemployment, we don't have to close police precincts, then MAYBE we could look at this.
However, any time Portland tries to make money off something like this (PFE, Armory Theater, SoWa) they get burned and taxpayers get stuck with their idiocy.
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Nice name calling. That's always fun to read. Blue Gardenia on Mississippi had a MBA and a PhD working there not too long ago. Unemployment is at 12%. I personally know 3 unemployed MBAs in my field who are currently bidding for barista jobs, retail jobs, and anything that will pay them money. What kind of study are you looking for here? We all know the unemployed and we all know people are looking. You can't read a news story or watch the news without hearing about open positions receiving 300-400 applicants. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that there are unemployed MBAs looking for work and they'll do anything. It just so happens barista and bartender are two jobs that pay pretty good that people tend to fight over because they don't totally suck. Hell, I have a friend who owns a popular bar that received 175+ resumes for one bartender position. I helped him weed through them and there were plenty of them that had masters degrees and even more with bachelor degrees. Unfortunately there aren't any specific studies to point to...but you'd have to be a rube to think MBAs aren't bidding for any job they can get at this point.
I quit bitching about the pothole and I did something about it. It was pretty easy actually. My neighbors thanked me.
The nicest thing about this stadium deal is that it doesn't touch the general fund...so nothing is going to suffer because we upgrade PGE.
That's nice you were against funding the Armory project as well...Curmudgeon.
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Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
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Ahem, they are paying for the shortfall on the original $35M we spent on PGE Park out of the general fund. If Paulson's bags the deal like he is abandoning the Beavers, we're stuck paying for this extra money out of the general fund.
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When you say "the Timbers Army will most likely dissolve (which is a non-profit organization) and the many projects that they participate in for other non-profit groups will cease to exist as well" do you really truly in your own head think ofr a moment that if the TIMBERS ARMY goes away that OPB, Outside In and HH will go be hurt by your passing?
You guys are amazing and have proved out a very telling point about your basis in reality. You need to hold more press conferences and make such statements more often, if nothing else then to give the rest of Portland a well deserved chuckle or three. Have you thought about doing a standup act? I am not saying your could be the next Mort Sahl but you might possibly reach a Ruppert Pupkin stature .. with practice.
You do good works, thats a great thing and something you should be proud of. But come on fellas, that gives you the right to shout in a folly like this stadium deal?
The public funding of a private stadium is as much a joke as the Timbers Army's proclamations of importance.
Then again with Randy Leonard as the seeming Cheerleader for this sort of Fan Boy Ego stroke its little wonder the we have had to endure this much of it in the press.
You want a MLS team and stadium, go fund it yourselves. I tell you what, I wont ask you to fund my hobbies and you keep your sports fetish out of my pockets.
Go in peace
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