This Week in the Mercury
Wednesday, August 19, 2009
Comic Books Day of the Tentacles
Posted by Alison Hallett on Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 7:41 PM
Hey, fellow people-who-think-comics-are-relevant. Remember the Great Marvel Tentacle Rape Dust-Up of Aught-Aught-Seven? You'd think maybe a lesson would have been learned after that point, right? Well... nope! This just happened, courtesy of Dark Horse*:
I think what we can all take from this is that if you're going to spotlight tentacle-on-lady art, at least make sure she's enjoying it. (And not, uh, getting raped.)
*Disappointed in you, BTW.
1
You must really hate the Japanese. P.S. The computer game you named this post after is one of my favorites of all time.
2
Spidey had problems with tentacles too! http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/amazing-spider-man/334-8.jpg
3
Your assumption that there is any implication of rape or anything remotely sexual about this is quite a stretch. This is a Star Wars comic. I would pretty much bet my left leg there is no tentacle rape in a Star Wars comic. Disappointed? I'm disappointed that a writer would feel remotely comfortable jumping to a conclusion like this and publishing it. And with such a self-righteous tone to boot. Sheesh.
4
Apparently, Fredric Wertham, the author of the 1950s anti-comics screed "Seduction of the Innocent," was right. "There are pictures within pictures for children who know how to look." Or, in this case, adolescent adults who insist on seeing something, even if it isn't there.
Are we to believe that now that the term "tentacle rape" has been coined, that any depiction of a woman being threatened by any creature (or, in this case, a robot) with tentacles automatically depicts rape? Alison, you've managed to take an image out of context and have assigned a completely erroneous (and obnoxious) motive to it. In point of fact, if you had bothered to read the sequence in the comic (pages 3-7), you would know that the robot (or "droid," to put it in Star Wars parlance) in question is designed to capture people, not rape them.
Do you also determine the facts of news stories by reading only the headlines? Really, I'm the one who's disappointed, Alison.
Randy Stradley
VP Publishing
Dark Horse Comics
Are we to believe that now that the term "tentacle rape" has been coined, that any depiction of a woman being threatened by any creature (or, in this case, a robot) with tentacles automatically depicts rape? Alison, you've managed to take an image out of context and have assigned a completely erroneous (and obnoxious) motive to it. In point of fact, if you had bothered to read the sequence in the comic (pages 3-7), you would know that the robot (or "droid," to put it in Star Wars parlance) in question is designed to capture people, not rape them.
Do you also determine the facts of news stories by reading only the headlines? Really, I'm the one who's disappointed, Alison.
Randy Stradley
VP Publishing
Dark Horse Comics
5
As a former designer at Dark Horse who worked on SW comics almost exclusively I can honestly say that "tentacle rape" is really a amateur response to this cover art... which is very nicely rendered, by the way.
7
I think her heaving breasts and slightly exposed thigh really seal the deal for this tentacle rape fantasy*
*Disappointed in you, BTW
*Disappointed in you, BTW
8
One more point. How do you know it's a lady? You live in Portland. There are a lot of pretty boys here. Hell, one of your coworkers plays in the Parenthetical Girls, and when I see pictures of them, he looks pretty girly to me. And frankly, that codpiece looks stuffed.
9
I'm a huge Dark Horse fan, but you know what guys? Stop playing innocent. You know as well as the rest of us (if not more so) that the history of comics is littered with these rapey fanboy fantasies. If you want to pretend that's not what's going on in this picture in order to assuage your guilt, that's one thing. But PUH-LEEZE don't insult the rest of us by trying to gaslight us into thinking we're the ones who are crazy.
10
I am a big fan of Wm. Steven Humphrey but I do not see how what is clearly a send-up of old horror movie posters, has been construed into a perverted rape fantasy. C'mon, the horror on her face, the tagline "Tentacles of Terror!"
http://bp1.blogger.com/_v0fV15P7uQo/RmQBoG…
Indeed, anything can be a hentai fantasy, but it's a little like calling the old Sears catalog a fetish book full of boots and stockings and all things erotic and blaming the mailman for delivering it to you.
I think Alison Hallet's post is disappointing, because she doesn't only imply this is a scene of rape, she says it outright.
With all the misogyny there already exists in the world (yes, even in the comics world) you don't need to go looking for it so hard on the cover of a Star Wars comic.
http://bp1.blogger.com/_v0fV15P7uQo/RmQBoG…
Indeed, anything can be a hentai fantasy, but it's a little like calling the old Sears catalog a fetish book full of boots and stockings and all things erotic and blaming the mailman for delivering it to you.
I think Alison Hallet's post is disappointing, because she doesn't only imply this is a scene of rape, she says it outright.
With all the misogyny there already exists in the world (yes, even in the comics world) you don't need to go looking for it so hard on the cover of a Star Wars comic.
11
Steven, come on. Your staff represents what should be a pretty open-minded segment of Portland — a town that is notoriously liberal, notoriously into life, liberty and the pursuit of naughty fun. You and Allison sound like a couple of old conservative ninnies in this argument. You may as well be calling breasts dirty pillows, for god's sake. Allison is right to care about the portrayal of women in comics. I do too. Which is why I care about things like a female character wearing ridiculously skimpy costumes that make no sense for their alleged function, just so all those "rapey fanboys" can see boobies. And it's why I care about artists drawing realistic looking people having realistic reactions, instead of every woman having "porn face" — that expressionless, mouth-open, slightly overwhelmed look. The woman shown on this cover is expressing genuine fear. And she's fully armored! Whole body! All over! If this is a rape fantasy, where's the exposed skin? The torn blouse?
The thing is you're both right that there are such rapey-fantasy conventions in comics, like in all mediums of entertainment. But this isn't an example of that. It's really, really important not to cry wolf about stuff like this. I'm fine with calling a spade a spade. But this thing you keep calling a spade is more like a duck. You're both astute enough to see that. If you don't, you're choosing not to.
The thing is you're both right that there are such rapey-fantasy conventions in comics, like in all mediums of entertainment. But this isn't an example of that. It's really, really important not to cry wolf about stuff like this. I'm fine with calling a spade a spade. But this thing you keep calling a spade is more like a duck. You're both astute enough to see that. If you don't, you're choosing not to.
12
Hi guys. Took the day off today; sorry I didn't respond sooner.
I stand by my response to this cover. Had the tentacle not been between her legs, I would've read it differently, but as editors, you should be aware of the implication: She's trapped. There's a tentacle between her thighs, and one working its way toward her mouth. Sorry, but: Look at the cover. Be as disappointed in me as you want; what you've earned, and particularly in your responses, is one less supporter of your work.
I stand by my response to this cover. Had the tentacle not been between her legs, I would've read it differently, but as editors, you should be aware of the implication: She's trapped. There's a tentacle between her thighs, and one working its way toward her mouth. Sorry, but: Look at the cover. Be as disappointed in me as you want; what you've earned, and particularly in your responses, is one less supporter of your work.
13
I am not an employee of Dark Horse, so if my disappointment in you calling this "rape" makes you less of a fan of Dark Horse, then I have done Dark Horse (and Star Wars) a disservice.
That being said, Alison, seriously, "rape" is a word that is very powerful. "Assualt" I can go with, but "rape" implies so much more. I am surprised by your response. Rape is not sex, but there is a physically sexual element to it. Sometimes a tentacle is not a penis. Just because one droid tentacle is situated between her leg (just above here space-suit covered knees) and another is near her space-suit covered face does not imply "rape".
If there was a slimy tentacle pointed at even a covered crotch I might think you have an argument, but I think you are crying wolf...or in this case "RAPE!"... at something where it is not even remotely deserved.
You don't seem to appreciate the accusation you are making.
What would have made this cover right for you? And as you think about your answer, please think about your answer.
That being said, Alison, seriously, "rape" is a word that is very powerful. "Assualt" I can go with, but "rape" implies so much more. I am surprised by your response. Rape is not sex, but there is a physically sexual element to it. Sometimes a tentacle is not a penis. Just because one droid tentacle is situated between her leg (just above here space-suit covered knees) and another is near her space-suit covered face does not imply "rape".
If there was a slimy tentacle pointed at even a covered crotch I might think you have an argument, but I think you are crying wolf...or in this case "RAPE!"... at something where it is not even remotely deserved.
You don't seem to appreciate the accusation you are making.
What would have made this cover right for you? And as you think about your answer, please think about your answer.
14
If the thing doesn't grab her between the legs, she gets away from it. Its entire purpose is to trap her. Where would you suggest a person-trapping robot with three appendages grab a human being in a way that it wouldn't fail at its mission? You keep saying "look at the cover." I'm looking at the cover, and there is no rape or suggestion of it here. The question you should ask is, would you think this were a rape cover it were exactly the same in every way, but the human character was man instead of a woman? I have a feeling you'd just think it was a droid with tentacles grabbing a dude. Which is what this is, sans dude. A character simply being female does not always change the implications of a scene, even a violent scene.
As editors, we do understand these things. If an artist turns in a sketch for a cover that totally makes sense if the assignment was to "draw this tentacled droid thing grabbing one of the characters", do you really think it would be reasonable to go back to said artist and say "Look, the way the thing is between her legs, a full foot from her crotch ... well, it's just ... you know. Rapey." No. Because - a) it's not. And - b) one of the other options for the artist in that case would be to do — what, the King Kong grab-around-the-waist thing? Boring, done to death, and ... talk about a worn-out image of women in danger. Another option would be to just make the character a man. Why? Because we're afraid if we show the equivalent female character being trapped by something with tentacle-like appendages, we'll be accused of being rapey.
Wow, those options both suck.
You guys do online polls, right? Post this against the Marvel sample you referenced earlier, and ask the question to the general public. I'm honestly very curious if there are other people who see rape in this. And before you shoot down the idea, do you have a way to make sure people vote only once? I would hate to be accused of also being a cheater at this point.
More...
As editors, we do understand these things. If an artist turns in a sketch for a cover that totally makes sense if the assignment was to "draw this tentacled droid thing grabbing one of the characters", do you really think it would be reasonable to go back to said artist and say "Look, the way the thing is between her legs, a full foot from her crotch ... well, it's just ... you know. Rapey." No. Because - a) it's not. And - b) one of the other options for the artist in that case would be to do — what, the King Kong grab-around-the-waist thing? Boring, done to death, and ... talk about a worn-out image of women in danger. Another option would be to just make the character a man. Why? Because we're afraid if we show the equivalent female character being trapped by something with tentacle-like appendages, we'll be accused of being rapey.
Wow, those options both suck.
You guys do online polls, right? Post this against the Marvel sample you referenced earlier, and ask the question to the general public. I'm honestly very curious if there are other people who see rape in this. And before you shoot down the idea, do you have a way to make sure people vote only once? I would hate to be accused of also being a cheater at this point.
15
Who knew Allison was so turned by and obsessed with Anime tentacle porn? But, really -I'm not judging. I'm on Fetltife for &$%@'s sake. (Allison, call me. You have a picture?)
16
Shawna it is reasonable, that's an editor's job. To be able to read subtexts in an image, and make adjustments accordingly. Because in this case A. It is. and B. The "tentacles" could easily be adjusted to negate the implications of rape which are in the resultant image. The title of this issue is also called "The Reaping Part 2" forchissake. Even if this wasn't aconscious decision, then the editors did a horrible job of making sure that the artwork and wording didn't even come close to teetering to such conclusions.
17
I like the part where a bunch of Dark Horse employees post comments all proclaiming that they're not Dark Horse employees and saying that an editors opinion is bullshit because they're too fucking dense too see subtleties and subtexts.
God... Dark Horse, be a fucking adult about this and cop to having a shitty cover. It's a stupid fucking Star Wars comic for gods' sake. Yeah, maybe KOTOR is the only IP that's making any cash these days, but just admit to having a poorly designed cover and move on.
Hasn't anyone learned yet that a cover-up is worse than accepting responsabilitiy?
God... Dark Horse, be a fucking adult about this and cop to having a shitty cover. It's a stupid fucking Star Wars comic for gods' sake. Yeah, maybe KOTOR is the only IP that's making any cash these days, but just admit to having a poorly designed cover and move on.
Hasn't anyone learned yet that a cover-up is worse than accepting responsabilitiy?
18
I guess what I can't get past is the assumption of our accusers that they can somehow know our intent. Now, I don't know the artist (Benjamin Carré) -- have never spoken to him or had any contact with him at all. However, I do know editor Dave Marshall, and I know that Dave would never put forth a cover image with ANY intended "rape" message or subtext. Likewise, I know that the panel of editors, art directors, and executives at Lucsfilm who view and approve (or reject, as the case may be) every cover from sketch to finished art to final cover with logos and blurbs in place, and who are fiercely protective of the Star Wars franchise, would never allow such a cover to be published. So, with a clear conscience, I can confidently proclaim the editor, Dark Horse, and Lucasfilm not guilty of all charges. There's no "cover up," because there is nothing to cover up. While we try to be sensitive to our readers, there's no way we can be aware of individual kink (any more than those readers can know the intent behind any image).
But it's obvious from at least some of the comments here -- including the blog that started it all -- that ugliness, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. The fact that some people see "rape" in this image says, I think, more about them than it does the image.
But it's obvious from at least some of the comments here -- including the blog that started it all -- that ugliness, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. The fact that some people see "rape" in this image says, I think, more about them than it does the image.
19
Graham: When you sign my paychecks you can tell me who I work for. You can call me a lot of things, but don't call me a liar.
Heyhermano: I am confused by your comment, as "reaping" doesn't mean "rape" unless you are saying that words that look like "rape" can imply rape. "Even if this wasn't a conscious decision" means that you think there might have been a conscious decision to depict an image of rape on the cover of this comic, which is a very strong accusation.
I think I will step off the crazy train here and sprinkle more fairy dust in my eyes and enjoy my rape-free comics.
Heyhermano: I am confused by your comment, as "reaping" doesn't mean "rape" unless you are saying that words that look like "rape" can imply rape. "Even if this wasn't a conscious decision" means that you think there might have been a conscious decision to depict an image of rape on the cover of this comic, which is a very strong accusation.
I think I will step off the crazy train here and sprinkle more fairy dust in my eyes and enjoy my rape-free comics.
20
It'd be nice to see both sides take a realistic approach to this minor story that's now blow-out of proportion.
The idea of something penis-like terrifying women has been around for, well, almost ever (see Genesis). And yes, there is probably something primal and sexual about it as we regress back to when the reproduction of our species was dependent on rape. (Unless you believe all those animals out there are "making love" on a consensual basis.)
But real question is - "Is this Star Wars cover meant to GIVE YOU A TEENAGE BONER like the Marvel cover?" I think the realistic answer is - no.
Yes there is something primal and terrifying and perhaps sexual about the cover, and yes entertainment (all of it, not just comics) has a lot of terrible depictions of women (some of it perpetrated and supported by women - which then calls in to question if the content is damning at all).
But yes it was a slow news day and we're just some online-rag that needed a story we thought would get some reactions.
Done and done. Welcome to the world of entertainment reporting. Each side should have been happy. One got a story, one got some coverage.
Obviously, neither side is going to budge because their professionalism has been called into question. And that's fine.
The "disappointed" comment was the only thing that I found odd in the this whole blogument (it's a word - try it out).
Alison, you're disappointed by this cover, this is the cover that made you DISAPPOINTED? Nothing else so far from the company that publishes Empowered, Gantz, Berserk, Space Pinchey, Conan, etc. offended you?
The idea of something penis-like terrifying women has been around for, well, almost ever (see Genesis). And yes, there is probably something primal and sexual about it as we regress back to when the reproduction of our species was dependent on rape. (Unless you believe all those animals out there are "making love" on a consensual basis.)
But real question is - "Is this Star Wars cover meant to GIVE YOU A TEENAGE BONER like the Marvel cover?" I think the realistic answer is - no.
Yes there is something primal and terrifying and perhaps sexual about the cover, and yes entertainment (all of it, not just comics) has a lot of terrible depictions of women (some of it perpetrated and supported by women - which then calls in to question if the content is damning at all).
But yes it was a slow news day and we're just some online-rag that needed a story we thought would get some reactions.
Done and done. Welcome to the world of entertainment reporting. Each side should have been happy. One got a story, one got some coverage.
Obviously, neither side is going to budge because their professionalism has been called into question. And that's fine.
The "disappointed" comment was the only thing that I found odd in the this whole blogument (it's a word - try it out).
Alison, you're disappointed by this cover, this is the cover that made you DISAPPOINTED? Nothing else so far from the company that publishes Empowered, Gantz, Berserk, Space Pinchey, Conan, etc. offended you?
21
J. Thomas, you are a liar. Ta-Da! Now get the fuck out.
Randy S, just because you, your editors, your artists and the dumb-asses over at Lucas Arts are oblivious to society and context doesn't mean that society and context don't exist. You live in an environment where "tentacle rape" has reached a meme level where people are making sodas named after the idea. In that context, any depiction of women and tentacles will automatically create an association with tentacle rape. If you are too dense to realize this, then you should find a new line of work because you fail at your job.
Randy S, just because you, your editors, your artists and the dumb-asses over at Lucas Arts are oblivious to society and context doesn't mean that society and context don't exist. You live in an environment where "tentacle rape" has reached a meme level where people are making sodas named after the idea. In that context, any depiction of women and tentacles will automatically create an association with tentacle rape. If you are too dense to realize this, then you should find a new line of work because you fail at your job.
22
Ridiculous! I generally enjoy the Mercury, but you need to get your heads out of your asses. Are you fucking serious? I realize that we live in a hyper-sexualized society, but I'm pretty sure the average person has never heard of--or thought of--tentacle porn.
This cover has obviously struck a nerve, but your reaction to it has absolutely nothing to do with reality and everything to do with what's rattling around in your head. Calling out Dark Horse because of your own personal issues smacks of someone who needs to step back and get a little perspective.
This cover has obviously struck a nerve, but your reaction to it has absolutely nothing to do with reality and everything to do with what's rattling around in your head. Calling out Dark Horse because of your own personal issues smacks of someone who needs to step back and get a little perspective.
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