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Monday, August 9, 2010

Should Portland Sing "Kumbaya" Around 10-Lane CRC?

Posted by Sarah Mirk on Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 11:33 AM

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  • BT Livermore
I'm currently huddled in the back of a major meeting at the Oregon Department of Transportation, where Mayor Sam Adams and the rest of the bigwig Project Sponsors Council are debating whether to sign off on a smaller Columbia River Crossing (CRC) bridge.

After the CRC had poured $40 million of public funds into paying consultants who came up with the plan for replacing the current six lane I-5 bridge across the river with a new $4.2 billion, 12-lane bridge, the city of Portland commissioned a $100,000 study that changed the course of the plans.

The brief study from URS consultants showed that a 10 lane bridge would work just as well as a 12-laner but save $50 million. The study also showed that building an eight-lane bridge would be far cheaper, but to improve the traffic situation, 37 percent of commuters would have to use public transit (versus three percent these days).

So here's big issue facing the critics of the project: Should they be content with a "less bad" option? Activist group Stop the CRC protested this morning's meeting with signs and banners, calling for Mayor Adams to reject the plan and try to get the bridge back the drawing board altogether. The coalition of environmental groups that form the strongest voice of opposition to the bridge penned an editorial that they hoped would run in the Oregonian this morning (it didn't) that spells out all the problems with this project, but stops short of saying Adams is making a mistake to move forward. Instead, it says the CRC staff should "conduct a detailed study of all the alternative recommendations."

"We clearly shouldn't all just be singing kumbaya around a 10-lane bridge," says Bicycle Transportation advocate Gerik Kransky.

"The key here is to build support for more study and actually look at alternatives," adds Environment Oregon advocate Brock Howell. "At some point, someone's going to sue this project, so let's get it right the first time or we'll be stuck in this thing for 10 years."

Read the environmentalists' full letter below the cut!

For once, Mayor Adams is getting along with the Project Sponsors Council this morning—everyone on the bigwig transportation committee seems to see Portland's study as a sign-off on okaying a 10-lane bridge. No one has so far noted that it would have saved a couple million dollars if the CRC staff had studied this idea years ago, like Mayor Adams and Metro President David Bragdon asked, rather than forcing Portland to go off and do the project's homework on its own dime, but, hey, no biggie.

Also, the head of the CRC independent review committee, Tom Warne, is phoning into the meeting right now. He couldn't make it to the meeting because he was conducting a funeral—death of freeways joke, anyone?

UPDATE 12:05 PM The biggest issue that Warne hits home is that the design of the current bridge is experimental—no one in the world has built a bridge like it, which means the additional testing and engineering required to make sure it's safe could cost $600,000 and take three years.

"That doesn't mean it shouldn't be built, we're just saying it's unique," says Warne. "The bottom line there is there's more work that needs to be done in order to advance the design."

With the news that the current design needs up to three years of extra engineering to even see if it works, environmentalists could have an inroad to push for serious study of alternate designs. /END UPDATE

Anyway, the letter from the green groups is a concise summation of all the main problems with the current bridge. Check it out:

Last week, the independent Columbia River Crossing review panel, appointed by Governor Kulongoski, published a critique of the CRC project. The review calls into question several major elements of the current proposal, including the design, financial plan, and environmental impact of the project. Their findings echo the concerns of project opponents who worry that the project is overly expensive and is completely out of line with Oregon's vision for reducing greenhouse gas emissions.

The study rightly emphasizes the project's "speculative" financial plan. With a total estimated cost of nearly $4 billion, a megaproject like the CRC is unlikely to receive full state and federal funding. If it did, it would lock up the state, federal and other transportation funding sources for the next decade or more and leave the rest of Oregon's transportation priorities with even fewer resources. Meanwhile, Oregon has cut $150 million from its education budget in 2009 and had another $259 million budget cut this year.

Now, even as Oregon must cut jobs to fill budget gaps, proponents of the current CRC are being forced to reexamine their proposed megaproject. The independent panel has made it clear that even the current proposal won't be able to move forward without redoing much of the analysis that was done early in the project. We also know that the current proposal would create congestion in the Rose Quarter and I-205, increase global warming pollution from cars and trucks, worsen air quality and decrease bicycle and pedestrian safety. These issues will ultimately cost us billions more to fix, and that money is not yet part of any proposed plan or budget.

The City of Portland commissioned URS, a construction and engineering firm, to analyze the CRC data, designs and strategies. The URS report shows that we can manage traffic, move freight and reduce automobile trips while protecting our economy and the environment. Instead of borrowing billions of dollars we don't have for an impractical project that won't meet our area's needs, we should be focused on designing the kind of project that the whole community can support.

This decision will be with us for a century or more. Rather than build the wrong project at great expense, we can develop a financially responsible solution that: (1) includes only as many lanes as we need and no more, (2) uses aggressive policy strategies to manage congestion and thereby save billions in construction dollars, (3) includes good options for public transit, walking and biking, (4) positively impacts the health of residents, and (5) is in line with the global warming reduction plans approved by Washington, Oregon and many local jurisdictions.

In order to achieve these principles, we urge the Project Sponsors Council to conduct a detailed study of all the alternative recommendations in the Portland/URS report.

Jill Fuglister, Co-Director, Coalition for a Livable Future
Mel Rader, Co-Director, Upstream Public Health
Jon Isaacs, Executive Director, Oregon League of Conservation Voters
Rob Sadowsky, Executive Director, Bicycle Transportation Alliance
Brock Howell, State Policy Advocate, Environment Oregon

 

Comments (40) RSS

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1
"Less bad" is not "good."

And Oregon has never been one to settle like that. I can't fathom why we would do so now.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 11:42 AM · Report
2
And I have to say, with the amount of respect I hold for the signers, that it sucks to have a typo in the second sentence of a very important letter.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 11:47 AM · Report
3
"Now, even as Oregon must cut jobs to fill budget gaps..."
Seems to me a large construction project would help in this regard.

"...decrease bicycle and pedestrian safety..."
How, exactly? Ever bike or walk across the existing structure? It's a death trap for cyclists. It's like storming the Death Star trench. New bridge, built with pedestrian and bicycle traffic in mind, would actually improve safety.

Bottom line is that this particular group of people will always fall in the anti-bridge camp, regardless of what form that project takes. Their input, as environmental champions, should absolutely be considered, but there's not a snowball's chance in global warming that they'll get everything they want.
Posted by nerdliness on August 9, 2010 at 11:48 AM · Report
4
Should Portland Sing "Kumbaya" Around 10-Lane CRC? Not until Vancouver agrees to tolls, MAX and paying their own future carbon tax within their own carbon quota.
Posted by R on August 9, 2010 at 11:53 AM · Report
5
nerdliness decides to tune in without any context or background. Fantastic armchair quarterbacking!

The bike/ped safety is in N/NE Portland, where congestion from a massive bridge expansion will be pushed. This 5-mile megahighway project is not just about the part that is over water.

And "this particular group of people" will do nothing of the sort. What "this particular group of people" have been asking for for years now is an actual public, forthright process to determine the best bridge for the future of the region.

An unaffordable, environmentally-flawed, congestion-increasing bridge is not what this region needs. And a couple thousand short-term construction jobs is stimulus, not recovery.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 11:54 AM · Report
6
>Not until Vancouver agrees to tolls

Tolls will happen. Even Leavitt, who ran and won on a we-don't-need-no-stinkin-tolls platform, seems to have come around on this. People on both sides will bitch, moan, and eventually come around on this one.

Portlanders should be careful what they wish for on this, though. With all the "make them Vancouver people" ranting, they forget how much of their own economy depends on people crossing the bridge to work and spend. Tolls need to be charged in such a way that you don't discourage too many of those people from coming over and taking advantage of the lack of Oregon sales tax (an idiotic policy in and of itself...).

>MAX

Another given. Don't believe I've seen any proposal that didn't include light-rail coming over. Granted, this should have been done a LONG time ago, but still.

>paying their own future carbon tax within their own carbon quota.

Won't even be considered directly, but maybe you could use the tolls thing to police it. For instance, charge less for car pooling, or have a sliding toll scale based on the fuel efficiency of the vehicles crossing, etc.
Posted by nerdliness on August 9, 2010 at 12:03 PM · Report
7
@nerdliness: As awful as the current bridge is, I don't think any cyclists or pedestrians have actually died trying to cross it. It is loud, narrow, hard to get to, etc, etc, but it isn't deadly.
Posted by Matthew D on August 9, 2010 at 12:09 PM · Report
8
@matthew d: Ok, that was a bit of an exaggeration. Still, though, it's not exactly safe or inviting in its current form. My point there was really to emphasize that you'd really have to try to make a new bridge less safe for peds/cyclists.
Posted by nerdliness on August 9, 2010 at 12:13 PM · Report
9
@Oregonmetry - don't hold the typo against the bridge critics, it was mine! Fixed now.

Everyone else - good discussion!
Posted by s.mirk on August 9, 2010 at 12:15 PM · Report
10
Like I and others said last time, saving $50 million on a $4+ billion project is nothing. Seen from another perspective, to get two extra lanes for that minor increase in cost would be crazy to pass up. And spending $600,000 to test a project of this scale doesn't seem like that much either.

These environmental and bike groups are naive and stuck in the Portland bubble. We need to get over our own sense of self-importance. And we REALLY need to get over our boorish chauvanism towards Vancouver. Haven't you guys figured out that we actually have vastly more suburbs on this side of the river?

Portland's beef should be about what happens south of the bridge, on Hayden Island and in the Rose Quarter. Those are our legitimate interests. The fact that people who live in Vancouver don't bike as much as we'd like them too is not a legitimate interest. People in Portland should worry about themselves instead of beating others over the head with your liberal "superiority."
Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 12:25 PM · Report
11
@Blabby - that's bullshit, Portlanders should definitely be concerned with what happens with the entire project because our tax dollars are at stake.

Yes, I've heard the canard that a larger bridge is necessary for freight traffic going up the I-5 corridor. However, the vast majority of all trips across the current bridge are commuters coming from the Vancouver area to Portland, and by asking Oregon to pay for a new, larger bridge we're essentially subsidizing Vancouver residents. Further, widening the bridge will just push congestion further into Portland. What's next, a call to widen I-5 through the Rose Quarter and downtown? We've already seen how freeway projects destroy inner-city neighborhoods and benefit only those who commute into the suburbs. After growing up in Portland I decided to stay here largely because the inner city hasn't been torn up with freeway projects. It makes little sense to vastly widen the bridge without planning on widening the freeway further to south; since doing the former is needlessly expensive and the latter appalling, why should I support this project?

I'm tired of being called a nativist or elitist when I stand up for the (very rational) self-interests of those who choose to live in Portland. Refusing to subsidize the unsustainable lifestyle of those across the river, who clearly depend on our city for jobs but frequently malign it, doesn't make someone self-important or a boorish chauvinist.
Posted by stephenjudkins on August 9, 2010 at 12:56 PM · Report
12
@Oregonmetry - Thanks, I didn't understand the letter's comment about decreasing bike safety, either. You said it will be because the construction will push traffic into N/NE Portland. Is the decrease in bike safety only during the construction phase, then? Or do they think there will be a permanent effect?

@everyone else - The letter also says that the proposed bridge will increase pollution. I know the official CRC presentation claims that it will *decrease* pollution. Hmmm...
Posted by Reymont on August 9, 2010 at 12:56 PM · Report
13
@stephenjudkins - The CRC presentation also says that current bridge trips are split evenly in both directions, that it's NOT just Vancouverites coming into Portland and going back home. I asked about that specifically, and the program director said that it hasn't been that way for a long time. Not saying I believe everything the man says, just reporting that's the official CRC position.

Oh! And, when asked about pushing traffic into the Rose Garden, he said that there was another unrelated project in the planning stages right now to smooth out that area as well. So apparently we can all stop worrying, right? ;)
Posted by Reymont on August 9, 2010 at 1:01 PM · Report
14
I just don't see how the bridge trips could be split evenly. I know this is anecdotal but I travel from Portland to Vancouver every work day and the traffic just doesn't compare. Are they averaging in weekends or just relying on people who don't regularly drive I-5 believing whatever "reasonable" thing they say?

I've lived on both sides of the river and one of the reasons we moved back to Oregon was because it was horrible commute for my partner from Vancouver to Portland. It's faster for me to go the other way.
Posted by Jinx on August 9, 2010 at 1:33 PM · Report
15
@Reymont: I haven't seen any presentations of the new bridge decreasing pollution. I've seen presentations that the second derivative of the pollution will be less under the new bridge, than under not doing anything AT ALL. This of course using their flawed "transportation doesn't affect land use" model, so I don't put a lot of weight in it, but nobody is advocating not doing anything at all so that is kind of a straw man anyways.
Posted by Matthew D on August 9, 2010 at 1:56 PM · Report
16
stephen j: You need to confirm some of your facts. If you have data on the % of bridge use attributable to Vancouver commuters please share the source.

"by asking Oregon to pay for a new, larger bridge we're essentially subsidizing Vancouver residents."
This project will be funded by multiple sources. Funds from the Feds and both Oregon and Washington will make up most of it. I think its fair for Washington to ask that the bridge meets some of their needs. THIS IS NOT A CITY OF PORTLAND PROJECT (funding-wise).

I agree with your concerns about pushing congestion south. I think those are legitimate concerns. I don't think that "I ride my bike everywhere and compost my own feces, so I'm a better person than everyone who lives in Vancouver" is a legitimate concern.


Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 2:12 PM · Report
17
Until they come up with a region-wide solution that prevents traffic just moving further South, Portland (and everyone else for that matter) shouldn't agree to anything. A slightly-less-expensive option that fails to achieve its stated goals is still an option that fails to achieve its stated goals.

I still believe that the best option (counter-intuitively, hence not appealing to the Oregonian-reading population) would be to remove I5 off the Eastbank and divert all that traffic onto I405, with one extra striped lane. Because it would get rid of the bottleneck caused by people having one lane to get onto I84. I may be wrong on that opinion, but I'd want to see a study that at least considers options like that. It hasn't been done yet, because the CRC-backers aren't smart enough to be interested in the big picture.
Posted by Stu on August 9, 2010 at 2:18 PM · Report
18
@Reymont - do you have a link to this presentation? I'd like to see what it says. I guess bridge traffic being "evenly split" is true if you aggregate together both the morning and evening rush hours, but anecdotally traffic is MUCH more congested going south in the AM and north in the PM, like @Jinx said. Casually looking at Google Map's historic traffic data seems to support this. I'm curious what they meant by that assertion.

As far as other projects in the works, I've been told state DOTs have a huge backlog of planned projects they keep "shovel-ready" in case any new federal or state dollars show up (at taxpayer expense, of course). When the federal stimulus plan was announced ODOT had a bunch of road-widening projects ready to submit while the City of Portland and Metro were left scrambling to come up with anything to compete. I'm sure ODOT has a revived Mt. Hood Freeway plan they'd just love to get started on.
Posted by stephenjudkins on August 9, 2010 at 2:31 PM · Report
19
@Stephen - Sorry, I don't. Sarah Mirk might. And that am/pm split was the basis of my question - he claimed that it's evenly split during all hours.

Posted by Reymont on August 9, 2010 at 3:06 PM · Report
20
@stephenjudkins You just made an excellent case for why we should have a regional transportation governance entity. Head over to http://www.pdxcityclub.org to view the report Moving Forward: A Better Way to Govern Regional Transportation.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 3:28 PM · Report
21
We HAVE a regional transportation governance entity. I think my eyes just rolled so far back into my head I can see my brain stem.

"Create a new agency to do what another agency already does. Start a million-dollar planning process. Form a committee. Convene a panel of national architects."

More process is the only answer we have around here. Apparently, anything is better then actually doing something.
Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 3:37 PM · Report
22
Which regional transportation governance entity is that, Blabby? You must know something I don't.

If you're referring to Metro, you might want to go figure out what Metro does.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 3:43 PM · Report
23
I am referring to Metro, and I know very well what it does, including planning and prioritizing regional transportation projects.
Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 3:45 PM · Report
24
It does nothing of the sort. It currently has zero authority on bridges, zero authority on transit, zero authority on state highways (arterials to many bridges) and has very little influence on the three counties and 26 municipalities competing for a limited amount of state and federal funds for transportation projects.

The extent to which Metro is any sort of transportation governance entity is to release the RTP.

Technically, Metro's charter allows for it to assume additional functions, including many related to transportation (like taking over operation of TriMet), but it currently only addresses transportation as part of framework for land-use and development planning.

It cannot raise money for transportation projects, it cannot make decisions on transportation projects and it cannot have any authority over the prioritization or planning of any of the three counties and 26 municipalities in the region.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 3:53 PM · Report
25
"Metro influences transportation spending in three ways. First, all projects that receive federal transportation funding must be included in the Regional Transportation Plan. TheRegional Transportation Plan identifies a 20-year list of future transportation projects based on regional transportation and land-use policies. Most transportation projects of importance to the region are funded with state and federal money."

http://www.oregonmetro.gov/index.cfm/go/by…
Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 3:57 PM · Report
26
@Blabby - From http://wweek.com/editorial/3428/11009/:
"Although the project is pitched as a bi-state partnership, traffic counts show the congestion on the I-5 bridges results primarily from Clark County commuters. During the morning rush hour, for instance, southbound traffic outnumbers northbound commuters by about 2 to 1. And figures show more than three-quarters of the vehicles carry only one person."

I assume they did their research (though I'd love to see their sources). Again, this seems very obvious to me after observing rush hour traffic on the bridge.

If you're noting any hostility towards you, it's because of your casual dismissal of all bridge critics as "boorish chauvinists", "naive", and "stuck in the Portland bubble". I see a well-crafted argument in the letter above, largely rooted in cost-benefit analysis, not any of the attitudes you describe. Perhaps you're projecting? Anecdotally, I have seen a lot more name-calling coming from bridge proponents than opponents.

"More process is the only answer we have around here. Apparently, anything is better then actually doing something."
Yeah, it's just $4 billion, no big deal, right? I'm OK with plenty of process for something that's not critical to complete in five years instead of six, and will be a major part of the region's infrastructure for the next hundred years. Especially since bridge opponents seem pretty outgunned by a massive lobbying effort from the construction industries and the state DOTs.
Posted by stephenjudkins on August 9, 2010 at 4:03 PM · Report
27
How does that address what I just explained? I acknowledged that Metro creates the RTP. That's far from regional transportation governance.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 4:03 PM · Report
28
stephenjudkins: thanks for the stats. I accept the 2 to 1 figure.

Oregonmetry: tomato/tomahto. We have an elected regional government in charge of planning and coordinating the regional transportation system. If they don't have enough dictatorial control over every aspect of budget and implementation for you, then I guess we disagree on that.

Thank god Metro doesn't run TriMet. It has enough problems.
Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 7:12 PM · Report
29
I am all in favor of the replacement of the Interstate Bridge, and it might just be the prospect of a new bridge that gets Vancouver to accept light rail into SW Washington.

Let's face it - very few people are going to want to bike from Vancouver or points north into Portland. The BTAers and other hardcores already live in places much more amenable to cycling to work areas. (And the elephant in the room is that the majority of people do not want to bicycle into work, and many cannot because of age, injury, or disability.)

Getting light rail into SW Washington will reduce traffic across the bridge, so long as adequate park-and-ride stops and Beaverton-style developments around light rail stops are developed.

The difference between this Little Depression and the Great Depression is that the people in Portland kick and scream against every public works project that doesn't involve their parochial interests - "Yes to the Streetcar, Down with the CRC!"

If the project benefits the metro area as a whole (including a huge influx of jobs in planning and construction of the bridge), it isn't sexy like a project that only benefits the "right kind of people" like the Pearl-to-SoWhat Streetcar, or the Eastside Line.
Posted by LawyerPepper on August 9, 2010 at 8:23 PM · Report
30
Blabby, you and I ought to get a beer sometime. I don't think I'm who you think I am on this issue, and I'd love to pick your (very analytical and obviously bright) brain over the stuff. Blogtown meetup on Thurs?
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 9, 2010 at 9:07 PM · Report
31
Thank you Oregometry. You are obviously bright yourself and I can tell actively engaged in these issues.

Thank you for the invite. Being the resident earnest troll who has lost my cool on just about everyone at one point or another, I'm hesitent to do any blogtown meetups. I will have to say no, but I will keep considering it. Missing Matt Davis' farewell party was a bummer....
Posted by Blabby on August 9, 2010 at 9:53 PM · Report
32
@LawyerPepper -
"And the elephant in the room is that the majority of people do not want to bicycle into work, and many cannot because of age, injury, or disability."
Yes, that's very true, but I don't think even the most optimistic bicycling supporters expect many people to bike the 10+ miles from suburban Vancouver to downtown Portland.

"The difference between this Little Depression and the Great Depression is that the people in Portland kick and scream against every public works project that doesn't involve their parochial interests - "Yes to the Streetcar, Down with the CRC!""
I grant you that irrational NIMBYism is a much bigger issue now than 80 years ago. As an aside, I think there's a lot of hostility towards the streetcar among many BTA/cycling types.

However, I think you're conflating the desire to "never build or upgrade any freeways again" with "the current CRC plan is a poorly designed, expensive boondoggle. There are is a convincing case to be made that expanding freeways does little to combat congestion in the long term, accelerates sprawl, and harms existing neighborhoods. I don't think any state DOT knows or cares how to design anything other than more, bigger freeways, and it's people from those departments (it's chaired by the head of Utah DOT) who have designed this bridge.
Posted by stephenjudkins on August 9, 2010 at 10:39 PM · Report
33
@ stephenjudkins - The point is to find the right size bridge that will 1.) eliminate the bottleneck of the Interstate Bridge (admittedly, there are other bottlenecks and problems on I-5 in Oregon, such as the elimination of a lane near Killingsworth, and the incredibly hazardous upper deck of the Marquam, which screens northbound traffic from merging traffic, then makes vehicles exiting onto I-84 do a "Boston move" to get into the exit lane in not enough room); 2.) expand light rail into Vancouver, with park-and-rides and Beaverton-style development around the stations; 3.) provide tons and tons of jobs during the construction project; and 4.) provide a symbol for the metro area like the Golden Gate Bridge.

Much of Portland's growth patterns have harmed neighborhoods by promoting dense upscale condo projects, driving up rental prices and forcing the current residents into outer reaches of the city or the suburbs. People need a place to live, and increasingly, the suburbs and Vancouver are that place to live. Do you want to raise a family in a crackerbox condo?

Posted by LawyerPepper on August 9, 2010 at 11:29 PM · Report
34
@Blabby: As one of the trolls on the other side around here, let me assure you that we aren't that evil in person. You should come.
Posted by Insane Matthew D on August 10, 2010 at 4:20 AM · Report
35
Matt D and I agree on something, Blabby!
Posted by Reymont on August 10, 2010 at 9:01 AM · Report
36
I think it's time for a "Socialize Blabby" Facebook group.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 10, 2010 at 9:48 AM · Report
37
Holy smokes. Despite all the shit talking early on, I have literally learned more about the CRC in reading this article (Mainly the comments, although you did a fine job, Sarah.) than anything else I've seen online. Well done all of you, you beautiful bastards, each and every one of you!
Posted by Infovorous on August 10, 2010 at 9:52 AM · Report
38
I'm not sure why cyclists/environmentalists are fighting this bridge so hard. I'm a cyclist and environmentalist and i'm not delusional enough to think that installing a max line and a bike/ped lane will eliminate traffic entirely. I know we are in a peak oil crisis and that oil is destroying the earth. but oil isn't the only thing that cars can run on. people use cars, people like cars, people like to travel on I-5 through portland will be using it. cars are never going to disappear. we've got electric cars, soon we'll have hydrogen cars, people get creative! why not plan for the future, when the population will obviously be greater, rather than build an infrastructure that does not support growth? hydrogen cars are gren energy, too.
Posted by harrypotter on August 11, 2010 at 1:16 AM · Report
39
@harrypotter, but you are naive enough to think that adding more vehicle lanes will eliminate traffic entirely?

We're anticipating one million additional residents in the metro region over the next 20 years (coming from hometowns like yours?), and we can't build our way out of that. We need to be looking at significant investments in multimodal infrastructure that will move PEOPLE, not just automobiles.

You could build a 14-lane bridge, but by 2030, those lanes will be just as clogged at rush hour as now. The answer is a bridge that reduces greenhouse gas emissions by providing 8 lanes (probably) with congestion pricing (tolls...with the automatic utility-style mechanism used all over the east coast) from Salmon Creek down to Wilsonville.

We need to start treating transportation like a utility. Only then will we have a sustainable revenue source (as you state...we're moving away from gas cars, and therefore losing gas tax revenue for roads and highways) so we can fix roads, build bridges and replace buses. Otherwise we'll just keep piecemealing it until we're blowing all our federal money on massive capital projects that simply retain the same fundamental flaws we have in our current infrastructure.
Posted by ($8239f8h248cerfehjf23@&*@ebdjhb23f237OCDBO#BD*(# on August 12, 2010 at 4:01 PM · Report
40
there does seem to be a trend here.

I dont know for a fact that the government hates poor people, but poor people usually live by the freeway, and breath poor air, and have poor health.

how about some cheap, smart solutions that we can start with soon:
http://vimeo.com/5419575
Posted by revphil on August 18, 2010 at 12:33 AM · Report

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